Or is everything and extrinsic social construct?




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  1. Jear77 1 month ago

    Separate from our animal nature? Possibly. Apparent Free will. But could that difference be only an illusion?

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    • Author
      griz 1 month ago

      @Jear77
      The question is more about the social constructionist view that humans are a blank slate and everything is merely an imprint of society. right and wrong, gender and sex roles, hierarchy of meaning and value.

      It’s the age-old slave versus Master mentality.

      The main reason to deny freedom and flee into the slave, is to avoid responsibility for oneself.

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz if there are things, forces unseen, unknowable through science, (as your belief there are), how can it be said we are responsible for our actions if we can’t truly know if our actions are influenced in large or incredibly subtle ways or not? There laws in society to say that say essentially “if you influence a person to do x or y based on a difference of power, you are legally culpable for their actions” – and if your beliefs are true, both god and the devil are in for some serious legal problems!

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      • Author
        griz 1 month ago

        @Jear77
        I would pay money to watch you try to use “the existence of the unknown” as legal defense unto avoiding responsibility for yourself!

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz thenit shouldn’t be able to be a thing to believe in.

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      • Author
        griz 1 month ago

        @Jear77
        I believe I’ve listed for you several times many many things that cannot be proven in court and cannot be proven by science but are essential parts of human life.

        You have an exceedingly short memory for the my friend. Either that or your ideology gobbles them up before you can drive any nourishment from them.

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz i can’t believe in anything unprovable either scientifically or logically. Occam’s razor would say it’s simpler to not believe in god… because it’s unnecessary… and his salvation plan is convoluted at best… and cruel at worse. Choose.

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      • Weenis 1 month ago

        @Jear77

        Your interpretation of Occams razor is jacked.

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      • Author
        griz 1 month ago

        @Jear77
        Do you remember the so-called evil trinity that I mentioned a while back?

        Resentment, arrogance and deception?

        Consider the self-deception in the assertion you cannot believe in anything unprovable by science and logic.

        Self-blinding stubbornness is a very strong belief many hold to that is not supported by logic or science. (And I could cite other examples in an exercise of over kill)

        In God’s plan of salvation through Christ the only thing remotely difficult (what you call convoluted or cruel), is mastering our attitude of arrogance and self-deception.
        Seeing it as convoluted and cruel just means that we are seeing our own nature superimposed.

        There can be no salvation from ourselves (our lower base nature that condemns), without first mastering this attitude.

        This holds regardless of whether one seeks salvation through God this whole regardless of whether that salvation is sought through science, through logic, Or through God.

        An arrogant attitude will mess them all up. (Leading to increased resentment and deception).

        In all those years were you seeking God’s greater glory; or just your own?

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz ALWAYS god’s. I lived WITHOUT pay for a DECADE helping the fully ungrateful homeless. There was never a thought to self-glory. Hell, that’s grammatically incorrect.

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      • Author
        griz 1 month ago

        @Jear77
        I don’t want to undersell what you sacrificed.

        But there is a critical point of attitude and intent: the very one that the Pharisees tripped up on.

        Was it just for God’s greater glory? Or for God’s greater glory plus I’m going to profit from this too?

        As with any relationship there are ways of behaving that are not exactly “forbidden”. But engaging in them limits the depth of relationship possible.

        Remember this isn’t a recipe or a legal contract.

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz i *never* %%asked%% for a dime. I figured when it came, it came. In fact, QUITE the opposite is true. I put $15,000 of my own money into it. How is investing in it doing so? It isn’t.

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      • Author
        griz 1 month ago

        @Jear77
        Profit does not always have to equal money.

        Glory does not always have to equal a spotlight.

        Final comment

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz remember your rules!

        It’s ironic that you say in another post something along the lines of solve these multiple threads and all these things will be cleared up, maybe more. You responded (essentially) the same thing thrice, sounding like a broken record?

        Ultimate “solving” can only occur after death… ONLY if you’re right. I can’t… I won’t live for the eventuality of that, as it can’t help instantly – nor will it ever be at the level I demand… so it’s useless to continue this train of thought. I don’t want to waste your time… nor have you waste mine. It has to be my decision, my choice… and it simply… is not.

        I had typed a lot more, erased it to try to give you a more concise answer, but even this turned out to be wordier than I had truly wanted, as it’s not fair.

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      • Author
        griz 1 month ago

        @Jear77
        I break the rules just to say I respect your process.

        You will always have a brother in me.

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      • Jear77 1 month ago

        @griz use this discussion, as they’re talking about the exact same things.

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  2. Weenis 1 month ago

    Jeremiah 17:9
    Romans 3:23
    Romans 5:12-19

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  3. Weenis 1 month ago

    The intrinsic will to live.

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    • Author
      griz 1 month ago

      @Weenis
      Also for freedom and justice.

      The desire for these cannot be attributed to a social construct.

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