This is the 18th school shooting in the United States in 2018. 40-50 shot, 17 confirmed dead today.

I don’t want to hear about your right to bear arms. That will never be taken away. We are the only country in the world to kill each other with guns at the rate we do. Many countries have the right to bear arms, but they do not kill like we do. We have a president who is trying to keep people out of this country or kick them out to protect us. These are AMERICAN KILLERS!!!! US Citizens killing AMERICANS!!!

What can we do? Suggestions? We need more than prayers man.

Here is an article about what bullets do to bodies.

http://highline.huffingtonpost.com/articles/en/gun-violence/

Just another day in America.




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  1. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    The above article about What Bullets Do to Bodies showcases: The gun debate would change in an instant if Americans witnessed the horrors that trauma surgeons confront every day.

    Oh yeah, happy valentines day.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCtzkaL2t_Y

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    • griz 1 year ago

      @Gina
      I wouldn’t count on it. Blame would be shifted. Responsibility eluded. The feeling and ego of self justified. The entity granting them their rights, actively sabotaged “in the name of rights”!

      If the US has not seen and repented of what it’s doing to itself by now . . . sufficient religious process is in effect that the nation will succumb to the burgeoning list of defunct nations and republics who have raced into mere footnotes of history while thinking themselves abundantly wise in doing so.

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @griz I agree, when we didn’t change any laws after little children were killed at their school in Sandy Hook; we are never going to change. BUT, like I said yesterday; there is a huge shift in our leadership heading our way. WE NEED MORE WOMEN IN CHARGE!!! When America gets more “maternal”, maybe we will change some laws, change the narrative, how boys treat girls, how girls treat boys…on and on. We are in a huge cultural shift right now, and that does give me hope. I am rambling, but I am mad and I am hurt and I am …out of my mind. Part of me wants to get the F out of this country. Why am i fighting for it?

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  2. Author
    Gina 1 year ago
  3. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    WE CAN WORK IT OUT.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qyclqo_AV2M

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  4. griz 1 year ago

    My condolences to the American brothers and sisters I’m in the midst of. A reality of my job is that I now spend more time in the US, relating with Americans of the US variety than with people in my own homeland.

    A fundamental re-assessment of the cost of a “right” to the greater whole . . . would seem to be the only feasible direction. A simple cost-to-benefit ratio. Most of the benefits do seem to be mostly to “the feelings”. And the “what if” of the leaders becoming what they for the most part have already become while the group with the most guns cheers!

    And you are talking about the peaceful and safe continuance of the entity granting the rights . .
    Big. Fat. Hmmm?

    An episode of Star Trek Voyagers caught my attention. The “Trekers” traveled back through time and encountered a group of distrustful and heavily-armed militant-types. And they heard a rant on the evils of collectivity and the sainthood of the individual .
    . . before being phasered into into bliss.

    And it’s a poignant reminder that I’m from another culture. Everything we as a civilization count on and take for granted . . . came from individuals . . . operating at the grace of the collective, and from within the collective . . . for the benefit of the collective . . . at the support of the collective.

    And without the collective, the individual is just alone, scared, unfunded, :frown: and in short order, rather socio-toxic.

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    • Author
      Gina 1 year ago

      @griz Thank you friend from the North.

      Canadians have the right to bear arms, but Canadians don’t kill each other with their guns at the level we do, as you know. I think a few things that are different really help the overall mental well-being of your country. The fact that you don’t have to worry if you get a life threatening disease, you won’t have to sell your house to pay your bills. I spend a lot of time in Canada, I watch a bit of your television, and you don’t have as much violence on your shows as we do. People are less stressed and kinder. That is a fact. I know Canada isn’t perfect, but it’s way more of a perfect union than it is here.

      A second grade teacher died the other day from the flu because she didn’t have the $125.00 dollars to cover the medicine she needed. That is wrong, wrong, wrong.

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  5. Weenis 1 year ago

    What do you suggest we do?

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    • Author
      Gina 1 year ago

      @Weenis I posted the question. I am asking, pleading, screaming, shedding tears.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again, if a teacher wants to carry a firearm concealed, they shouldn’t be prohibited by law.

        Outside of that, there’s little we can do.

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis I do respect your opinion when it comes to guns, as you are very knowledgeable on this topic. I don’t see how arming the teachers would prevent people being maimed and killed. It would be a shootout. The killer today shot people outside and inside the school.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        Shooters go into a school knowing no one inside legally carries a firearm. It’s much easier to stop the shooter when they’re inside the building if a dozen or so teachers are carrying a concealed firearm.

        You’re right, people were shot outside and inside the school. But people are shot outside schools all the time. While filling up at a gas station, or at a mall, or walking along the road.

        It’s important to keep in mind that these types of events aren’t even 1% of all firearm deaths in the US. So it’s not like anyone can attempt to legislate a particular type of firearm.

        Then keep in mind, the particular type of firearm that people might try to legislate against will be grandfathered in. So availability would still persist.

        There are billions of rounds of ammunition in the US, so that’s a difficult path to go down.

        There isn’t any real way to prevent someone from getting access to a gun.

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis Yes, there would be illegal weapons out there, but don’t you think making it harder to get access to these weapons would at least slow down the killings?

        As I am sure you know, Australia had a mass shooting where 35 were kill, they enacted strict gun control, the most dramatic of these was a buyback program in which the government purchased and destroyed more than 600,000 long guns, nearly halving the number of gun-owning households in the country. They have had zero mass shootings in that past 21 years. So there is evidence that major change save lives.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        I’m going to be answering these questions as practically as I can, without invoking any constitutional right argument.

        So, you brought up the 600,000 long guns destroyed in Australia. The majority of those guns were hunting type rifles and shotguns, very little of the scary black guns that are being used in our school shootings here in the US.

        Inside the US there is an estimated 5 million to 10 million AR-15’s. That’s the scary black gun that people use in Vegas, Florida, etc. That’s a +/-2.5 million estimate from 7.5 million AR-15’s. There are a total estimated 600,000 million guns in all of the United States of America. These are low numbers, there are much much more than this because in the US it’s legal to make your own gun from scratch without reporting it. So there are AR-15’s that are made at home with no serial and didn’t come from any type of manufacturer.

        Gun Buybacks don’t work in the US, we’ve tried it. We’ve tried to do buybacks when it’s actually completely legal to buy guns, there’s just no incentive or reason to participate in the buy back. It would be quite an issue in America if there was some type of _required_ buyback of a particular type of gun or any gun in general. That wouldn’t be a good thing at all.

        Now, you mentioned “these weapons”, I’m assuming you are attempting to make it harder to get access to AR-15’s, but if there are 7.5 million of them in the United States, how do you do this? You really can’t. Also, why punish the up to 7.5 million good guys for the actions of 5 or 10 people a year that kill a total of 300 people a year? The good provided by these weapons outweighs the bad actions of the few. By passing some type of legislation regarding “these weapons” you’re not even addressing a half of a percent of all the murders in the US.

        When comparisons of the US and Australia or the UK are made, these aren’t fair comparisons. The culture is entirely different. The population density is entirely different. The weapons that the 3 different countries had/have access to is entirely different. We can’t say what the outcome would be if we did do what Australia did by banning guns. It’s a bad pandora’s box issue.

        When you state that “they have had zero mass shootings in that past 21 years. So there is evidence that major change save lives.” This is simply not correct. In 2014 they had the Hunt family murders, which used a firearm.

        Also, if you look at the crime rates prior to 1996 when they banned guns, you can see that there were very little Massacres in Australia prior to the gun ban.

        There’s a fundamental difference between other countries and the United States.

        The fact we’re talking about it right now is because of how politicized it’s become, and the news agencies are attention whore’s.

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      • Georockstar09 1 year ago

        @Weenis I’ve read some of your reasoning, and while I get what you are saying, the thing is we are doing nothing – NOTHING!! – to even make it a little harder for unstable people to get access to guns. So what, we’re not even going to try, because the data says this and that???

        As for the “good guys” that have guns, are they going to suffer so much if their precious little toys are taken away from them??

        You say 1% of shootings are school/public shootings and that’s not a lot – but ALL of those victims were innocent. 1% is a huge number. In science we talk about 0.1% being a lot. Does it make a difference if I told you 50% of gun deaths are suicides?

        You say UK and Australian cultures are different. So what, we shouldn’t change OUR culture?? Is it that precious that it needs to be preserved? Or can we just ditch the gun culture so that thousands of people don’t have to die each year?

        So I ask you, and anyone else, this – SHOULDN’T WE TRY SOMETHING?? Because we’ve done nothing, we’ve even increased gun possession, and that hasn’t worked.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Georockstar09

        By saying “I’ve read some of your reasoning” i hope that means you’ve read my whole post, because I have the courtesy to read your whole post and attempt to respond in kind.

        Since your first paragraph states “make it a little harder for unstable people to get access to guns”, I’m going to assume you didn’t read my entire post. So I’ll just ask you a question, what do you think we could do to make it harder for unstable people to get access to guns?

        Regarding your 1% comment, I actually said it’s far less than 1%. I calculated the 2017 percentage, it’s .0221%. So we’re talking about literally a fraction of a single percentage. And that .0222% gets ALL the media coverage, and then people lose their minds and want to start changing culture, removing guns, and enacting crazy precedent setting laws. No, it doesn’t make a difference that 50% are suicides, I’ve brought up this point repeatedly on this site and it doesn’t seem to cause anyone to bat an eye. It’s also worth pointing out that my .0222% number doesn’t include suicides. If we get the mass shooting deaths as a percentage of ALL shooting deaths including suicides, then the percentage falls to an even lower .0092%

        For the above calculations, I used http://www.gunviolencearchive.org/, which is an anti-gun organization.

        Now, moving on to culture, you mention we should just “change OUR culture.” Explain to me, how do you do that? How do you do that, especially if you’re in the minority view? Remember, there are 600,000,000 guns out there. 600 MILLION. So you’re of a position where we should just “change OUR culture”, which is a monumental task in itself, in the face of a culture that has a massive number of gun owners.

        According to pew research – http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2017/06/22/the-demographics-of-gun-ownership/

        We’re looking at the 1/3’s. These are the same percentages we faced during the American Revolution. Basically, the numbers break down like this, 1/3 currently owns guns (and even then, multiple guns), 1/3 is open to owning one, and 1/3 is against owning a gun. During the American Revolution, 1/3 wanted to revolve, 1/3 didn’t care either way, and 1/3 wanted to stay under English rule.

        You’ve mentioned multiple times “gun culture”, as if it’s a bunch of people sitting around in homes caressing their guns. Shooting is an Olympic Sport. My son is signed up for competitive air gun, using the same guns many countries use in the Olympics. The target aspect of guns is just one aspect. There’s a self-defense aspect, there’s a hunting aspect, there’s a long range aspect, there’s a speed aspect. There’s not just one big gun culture, it’s made up of several different types of gun owners, that all have their different set of beliefs.

        For instance, right now, there’s a big segment of the “gun culture” that is revolting against the NRA and going to the GOA. Many people, myself included, think that the NRA is to ready and willing to compromise, and not hard enough in defending a pro-gun stance. So this big “gun culture” you speak of is made up of many different segments of society and isn’t in any one one big lump of people that are all the same.

        Now, you’re final question is, “SHOULDN’T WE TRY SOMETHING?” And to that I have two questions, 1) What do you propose we do? and 2) Why OUGHT we try something?

        Regarding the most recent shooting, people did try something. The FBI was tipped off regarding the shooter’s threats. The shooter was expelled from school for threatening the lives of other students. This isn’t some lone wolf, isolated, and unforeseen event. Other’s may have been, previous shootings were quite alarming and unpredictable, but this one in Florida surely wasn’t.

        So if we want to “try something” in response to the high school shooting in Florida, then I suggest allowing teachers the ability to carry a gun, and I suggest that the FBI follow protocol in following up on threats against people’s lives.

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      • Georockstar09 1 year ago

        @Weenis I’m sorry, your posts do tend to get quite long, and while I try to pay attention to every teeny tiny detail, I might miss your main points. Maybe try to be more succinct.

        How to make it harder for unstable people: This has been discussed many times by many people and there are great ideas out there. When getting a licence to own a gun, people might have to pass a rigorous exam that assesses mental stability. That’s just one idea. There are plenty of ideas out there that had been proposed for legislature. You can literally just google this.

        My point with the suicides was to point out mental instability – those people shouldn’t have owned a gun either.

        As for your other arguments – I’m not going into a long blurb here, I’ll just leave it at this – there’s a fine line between all the “aspects” you mention, and most “aspects” treat guns as literally toys. Playthings. Guns are not the best methods for self defense. There are other methods, but if you really need one for self defense then fine. But not a semi-automatic.

        So being pro-gun, to me, especially after what you described, is mainly defending a toy.

        Mind you, I’m not saying taking away ALL guns. I’m talking about personal ownership of these petty playthings, like AK-47’s. There are plenty of other hobbies to pursue.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Georockstar09

        There’s no real way to make it harder for unstable people to get access to guns. As I’ve mentioned many times, there’s a total of 600 million guns in the US. And any of the unstable people can go anywhere to buy one, or even make one. Cocaine is completely illegal, everyone in the united states, yet we can go buy it anywhere. If we can’t get rid of Cocaine, which pretty much EVERYONE agrees is wrong, then how do you propose stopping guns from getting into someone’s hand, when 1/3 of the population things guns are good?

        Just because someone commits suicide doesn’t mean they’re mentally unstable prior to the suicide. Oftentimes suicide is a result of some occasion or life choice that causes depression. Prior to the suicide, they might have been 100% normal folks who you would have no clue or way to test for mental instability. There are a lot of situations in which someone goes to a gun range, rents a gun, and shoots themselves. These individuals didn’t even purchase a gun.

        You said- “Guns are not the best methods for self defense.”

        What? What is a better method for self defense than a gun?

        You said- “So being pro-gun, to me, especially after what you described, is mainly defending a toy.”

        I disagree with your caricature, as it’s making assumptions of me which I don’t hold.

        So, finally, the crux of it, you want to take away the big black scary guns.

        Just so I understand your position, you’re proposing to ban 7.5mil AR-15’s (plus or minus 2.5mil) at the expense of .0092% of gun deaths per year?

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      • Georockstar09 1 year ago

        @Weenis Answer to your last question: Yes. Absolutely yes. Your puny 0.009% after all DOES amount to several hundred people.

        There have been toys or objects placed on the market meant for one thing. Kids and adults started using them for another thing that either harmed themselves or harmed others, therefore companies decided to revoke them. There are plenty of examples.

        So let’s do the same for semi-automatics.

        Or do we just pretend that those lost lives never happened, or had nothing to do with us?

        But other discussions here have pointed out that we need to treat the underlying disease rather than treat the symptom. So I’m changing my stance to that.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Georockstar09

        The fact that you think that’s rational or logical proves we can’t have a meaningful debate. That’s a completely illogical conclusion to any of this.

        As Jefferson was oft to say and quoted-

        Writing “False idee di utilità (“false ideas of utility”) in the margin, Jefferson copied in Italian into his Commonplace Book the following passage from Beccaria:

        False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils, except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm those only who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Can it be supposed that those who have the courage to violate the most sacred laws of humanity, the most important of the code, will respect the less important and arbitrary ones, which can be violated with ease and impunity, and which, if strictly obeyed, would put an end to personal liberty—so dear to men, so dear to the enlightened legislator—and subject innocent persons to all the vexations that the guilty alone ought to suffer? Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. They ought to be designated as laws not preventive bur fearful of crimes, produced by the tumultuous impression of a few isolated facts, and not by thoughtful consideration of the inconveniences and advantages of a universal decree.

        Banning all AR-15’s is akin to banning fire because it burns.

        Semi-automatics are what most civilians carry as a self-defense concealment option. A semi-automatic doesn’t just include a rifle, but pistols as well.

        At the end of the post you mention you’re changing your stance, so does this now mean you’re wanting to treat the underlying disease and not ban all the scary black guns?

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      • Georockstar09 1 year ago

        @Weenis Sorry your posts are too long for me to do other than skim them.

        We don’t need AR-15’s and AK-47’s. We can live without them. Fire is useful. These guns aren’t, unless in the hands of military. I’m not talking about pistols. I’m talking about the big guns. Sorry if I used wrong terminology. You could just settle for a pistol.

        I get why you’re upset now. You don’t seem to understand what I am saying, so let me clarify: Ban big guns that are only used as hobbies anyway. Regulate small guns.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Georockstar09

        I quoted Thomas Jefferson. It seems your inability to read is evidence of our failing school system.

        AR-15’s are used for hunting, and for the last 60 years some of the biggest target matches in the united states.

        Again, to ban 7.5mil AR-15’s (plus or minus 2.5mil) at the expense of .0092% of gun deaths per year is completely illogical.

        I’m open to your arguments as to why banning all those guns for .0092% of gun deaths is a logical position, but so far you’re just stating we need to do it, as if it’s a logical argument. You’re not proving anything. To take away MILLIONS of guns, millions, for .0092% of gun deaths per year makes no sense. It’s an appeal to emotion.

        Also, how would we get all these 7.5mil AR-15’s (plus or minus 2.5mil)?

        You know guns are banned in prison, right? All guns. They’re all banned in prison. Prisoners still get guns in prison. There’s a lot list of things that are legit BANNED in prison, that people still get. Cell phones, drugs, drones, etc.

        If we can’t regulate prisoners, who are under lock and key 24 hours a day 7 days a week, what makes you think you’re going to regulate 323.1 million people, who aren’t under constant surveillance?

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      • Georockstar09 1 year ago

        @Weenis Uff… not failing school system, I just gotta go. I’ll make this brief.

        Hunting is a hobby. People who absolutely have to hunt can obviously get an exception. Companies have changed/ revoked products or made regulations after even just ONE death. Stop selling AK 47’s and go from there. (I know what you’ll say – they can get them from other countries etc. etc. but at least we can reduce their numbers). American prisons are messed up. Gotta go.

        I won’t change your mind, you won’t change mine, let’s call it quits. Spitfire said something interesting things.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Georockstar09

        Thanks for the lack of attention and intellectual stimulation. This was quite easy.

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      • Georockstar09 1 year ago

        @Weenis These arguments are just drawing battle lines with the whole back-and-forth of “no, we should reduce guns” and “no we should increase guns” and going nowhere.

        Like Spitfire said, we need to address the underlying issue that leads a school shooter to be a school shooter in the first place. Otherwise we’re just pulling teeth on trying to get this fixed.

        Not that I’m suddenly pro-gun or anything, but that we need to change our focus in order to be more efficient. I still don’t see what someone needs an AK-47 as anything besides a toy, and I have no sympathy for people losing them.

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis The current head of the FBI is a trump pick. That explains why this was handled so badly. Trump is terrible at picking the “best” people. Director Christopher Wray is being asked to step by down Gov Rick Scott, who is a Republican.

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  6. ladybarbara 1 year ago

    One thing about the killer today —– he told his friends what he was planning to do. He had talked about it for days before really doing what he said he would do. Not one of his friends reported his outlandish and horrid plan to anyone.

    If you see something, say something!!! ———- But, no one said a thing.

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    • Author
      Gina 1 year ago

      @ladybarbara Yep. A Grandmother Helped Stop Another School Shooting a Day Before the Florida Massacre. Authorities arrested a Washington state student suspected in a school shooting plot after his grandmother showed officers plans for an attack.

      http://time.com/5159578/student-suspect-washington-state-school-shooting-plot/

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        Except with this one, a youtuber emailed and called the FBI 5 months ago to let them know that user “Nikolas Cruz” left a comment on his video that stated he was going to be “a professional school shooter”.

        https://youtu.be/yWILT8yqQHE

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis Trump appointed head of the FBI needs to step down. Yep, I agree. Trump does NOT know how to pick the best people.

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    • griz 1 year ago

      @ladybarbara
      Actually, it seems that one (perhaps several?) did.

      But the “right to bear arms” is so entrenched in the US, the FBI knew their hands were tied.

      As for what to do? Perhaps a simple cost-to-benefit ratio of “the right” is in order? Most (all?) of the benefits are totally emotional. But the costs are piling up at the morgue.

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      • ladybarbara 1 year ago

        @griz The report was taken and then somebody at the FBI decided not to act on it. Someone decided that it was not worth looking into. I hope that person knows that they dropped the ball and had a hand in the deaths.

        If they felt their hands were tied and used it as a lame excuse to not investigate, it may be because an ACTUAL crime had not been perpetrated, yet.

        I once went to the police because my husband was threatening to kill me, chop my dead body up and bury me in the desert. The policeman asked me if my husband had battered me in any way. “No, but he threatened to kill me!”
        No crime had been committed. The policeman told me to move out and not stay with a man who is threatening my life. I stayed because I thought I could talk him out of harming me.

        Until my husband ACTUALLY attacked me, or killed me, nothing could be done.

        A few weeks later, I was carrying my cat and my husband threw a meat cleaver at my chest. It cut my cat in two. With half of a cat still in my arms, I drove to the police station and pressed charges against him. Now that there was an attack with intent to kill, and an animal died from the attack, he was charged with cruelty and the killing of the cat. He was charged with spousal abuse and I was taken to a shelter for abused women.

        An ACTUAL crime has to be committed before there can be an arrest, or any action taken.

        It had to be the same situation in the school shootings. The FBI was told and failed to do anything about it ——- because an ACTUAL crime had not yet been committed.

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      • griz 1 year ago

        @ladybarbara
        And also perhaps because it involved a much-loved Amendment that in the minds of most supersedes all.

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  7. Georockstar09 1 year ago

    What can we do? Ditch the gun culture. Guns are popular only because people make them popular. How about we defame them a little. We could reduce depicting guns in movies, and we could stop showing those movies with lots of guns to our kids.

    We could try to make sure that we are all connected with each and every person in our lives and our communities, so that isolationists like these shooters don’t emerge, or that they can be spotted more easily and dealt with before they break out.

    I don’t know, this is so stupid. How many innocent people in the US need to die in an accident before companies make sure it never happens again? Very few, maybe 1-2.

    How many before we change something about guns? Hundreds upon thousands, and their body count is still rising.

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    • Author
      Gina 1 year ago

      @Georockstar09 I totally agree with you. It appears this country loves it’s guns more than it’s children.

      Improving gun laws is a major step, but you are so right. In so many ways Americans are disconnected from one another. We are also very unhealthy from the food we eat, the air we breath and the water we drink. There are many things this country needs to improve on which is all interconnected.

      Have you seen Michael Moore’s last documentary, Where to Invade Next? The title is misleading. Here is a description:

      Filmmaker Michael Moore visits various countries to examine how Europeans view work, education, health care, sex, equality, and other issues. From cafeteria food to sex ed, Moore looks at the benefits of schooling in France, Finland and Slovenia. In Italy, he marvels at how workers enjoy reasonable hours and generous vacation time. In Portugal, Moore notes the effects of the decriminalization of drugs. Through his travels, we discover just how different America is from the rest of the world.

      He finds something that works really well in many countries, and suggests we try these amazing things in the US.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJoRpY4SKPI&t=15s

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        This comment right here is why I don’t think you’re open to dialogue and real critical thinking.

        I’m making a strong attempt to have a practical conversation with you above, and you respond 33 minutes ago with-

        “I totally agree with you. It appears this country loves it’s guns more than it’s children.”

        That has nothing to do with it, as outlined in the arguments above. How do you get rid of 600 million guns?

        Even if we assume that “this country loves its guns”, how and why do you think your position is correct to change this country out of its love?

        Who are you to tell people who/what to love?

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis “Who are you to tell people who/what to love?” That is just sick.

        In regards to arming teachers, shit; teachers have to buy their own damn supplies. Who is going to pay for it?

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        Why is “that just sick”? Explain why it’s sick please.

        Many teachers can’t legally carry in school, while legally carrying outside school. Some states allow teachers to lock up their firearm in their car, in the parking lot, but not all schools.

        Just because teachers don’t have the resources like pencils and printer ink doesn’t mean those same teachers live at home with no pencils, no printer ink, and no guns outside of school.

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis The fact that you would equate the love of guns with the love of a human. No thing should be loved more than any human being. What the fuck kind of “Christian” are you?

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        You are literally the one that made the assertion…

        It appears this country loves it’s guns more than it’s children.

        So, I’m accepting your assertion, and I’m asking you who you are to tell people who or what to love.

        I can’t talk you out of the fact that you’re making an assertion that gun owners “love guns”, so I’m asking you why you think that’s wrong, and I want to know who you think you are to tell people who/what they can love?

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  8. five2one 1 year ago

    The answer to this has to come from Heaven, like most of the world’s problems. Human beings don’t know why these things are happening, so they definitely can not bring an answer.

    We told them and told them and told them, but they can not believe even the meagerest puff of pixie dust.

    Others not believing in something very real does not cease to make it real.

    A major problem people have, it appears.

    This world will not always be a place where the veil is shut tight, and faith is a rarest of jewels. But that is how it is now. And even the sweetest of them that refuse to even try to believe are guilty with the rest.

    Donald Trump and his team.

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    • Author
      Gina 1 year ago

      @five2one We pray after every single f’ing shooting. Where has that gotten us. I call BS!

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      • five2one 1 year ago

        @Gina *shrug*

        I am a magical being, in the flesh. I am extraordinarily aware there is no faith on earth.

        I have an immortal body, and I am part man, part woman — not in the hermaphrodite way. Really, even pictures show that. If anyone had an eye to detail.

        Adam was created by himself… and later, woman was pulled out from him. I am not from Adam, so I never had half of my body put into someone else. And so have all the benefits of both male and female. Not sexual differences. But female capacity to communicate, female capacity to love and nurture, etc, etc. More then human female flesh softness. I do not age past the prime age which is thirty. I am immortal. I am not originally from planet earth.

        And, I – or my wife, more specifically – can work miracles.

        But, no faith on earth.

        No one ever asks.

        There are life forms other then just human in the universe. It is painfully conceited to think otherwise. I am one from another life form. There are many others.

        Why should we give when people don’t want us around, because we challenge their being simply by existing?

        So, we watch and do our own thing.

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  9. Spitfire3dC 1 year ago

    The guns are a symptom. They are not the disease.

    Trying to talk practically to support any argument supporting gun control or not, is actually irrelevant because the core disease still exists. It really comes down to this. America, as a society is a control freak. The American society thinks it can manage everything, and do it better than everyone. The entire society is founded on this control issue. It happens domestically and it happens globally.

    To some, the solution is “I have a gun, so don’t endanger me or I’ll blow your head off” To others it about no one having guns. Either way it’s about control.

    Treating symptoms, versus the disease, is also the American way. There’s more money in it.

    It;s time to just face the facts, because if you don’t really understand what the root problem is; you will never get close to solving the core issue.

    These kids who go into the school want to take control. These gangs that shoot each other in the streets want control. Organized crime and drug cartels all wrestling to illustrate supreme control.

    America has conditioned itself to believe that it has the capacity to control everything, but the reality is that that is a false presumption. For all the money put into a military might; is the world a better, or worse place? For all the money put into paramilitary policing; are the streets safer?

    Concentrate on the real problem. This sickness that resides in the need for control that invariably leads to actions to illustrate it. Most of these child murderers at the schools are taking control the only way they can. To be killed or imprisoned may seem, to them, a small price to pay for their own knowledge that they took control, even if only temporarily.

    That is the sickness. That is the problem. Remove this overriding sense that as an American; you can control everything. Its a huge task, but it is the only way to remove the stigma of not being in control is unacceptable…and there is a difference between control and effective management. Effective management includes encouraging people to want to be part of the solution, not telling them they have to be.

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    • Georockstar09 1 year ago

      @Spitfire3dC I totally agree with you, now that I think about it. We really do need to start treating the underlying disease, and with it, maybe we will disentagle people’s love for guns.

      But I don’t think the problem is desire for control. I think the problem is that we have a society at large that produces antisocial, isolationist white teenagers that by the time they are 18-19 they basically have the knowledge of 10-year-olds with hormones who don’t understand how the world works. And some of them get really really frustrated…

      And not just kids. The Vegas shooter was middle aged, but most adults tend to know how to reach out at a certain point. Not all, though.

      So the solution, the cure, I think, is to be better connected to one another. Have families outside of families, that is, treat a community as a family. It takes collective effort. After all, what was that kid raging about? Lack of acceptance in the only community he knew, perhaps?

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      • Spitfire3dC 1 year ago

        @Georockstar09 try not to mix up love of guns with love of control. Read how the people on this site, who think guns are good illustrate their own penchant for control. One is such a control freak he won’t let the public school system teach his children. He wants to control that aspect of their lives regardless of the negative social implications that could influence their ability to be contributing participants.

        Another is a former Viet Nam vet who had to be conditioned to be a controller because that’s what taking the stars and stripes overseas requires. Then he becomes a prison guard. An extension of what his mind has been shaped to. A very good man in other aspects of who he is, but a victim of the American experience

        I’m not trying to insult either one of these gentlemen. They are victims of the establishment of a paradigm that started a long time ago when the Fathers of the Revolution decided to take control away from status quo…and won. It has been reinforced time and again with every victory promoted. Think about what that flag raising at Iwo Jima represents. It says, “Don’t fuck with us” and that has become the foundation for what America is., for better or for worse

        It is such an overriding attitude that many don’t care that they are referred to as Ugly Americans when travelling overseas. They take it as a badge of honour. Other peoples’ jealousies of their accomplishments, both real and imagined.

        The development of anti-social behaviour is real too. I think it might come from the realization that no one is really in control. We’re all going to die, so may as well wait it out in the on-off environment of a video game.

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  10. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Wednesday’s mass shooting at a high school in Parkland, Florida, that has left at least 17 kids dead is a good time to remember how hollow and vacuous many of our elected officials’ “thoughts and prayers” sentiments are. While the NRA and the Republican Party spend the next many hours discussing mental illness and how the real issue is the mental illness that they are completely unwilling to tackle regardless of how many people die, let’s remember that meaningful gun safety laws could be enacted right now. Those laws haven’t been created because the NRA owns the Republican Party. A few months ago the New York Times put together a list of the senators and congressmen and women who receive the most financial funding from the NRA. Here’s the list with each Republican:

    Sen. John McCain (R-AR) $7,740,521

    Sen. Richard Burr (R-NC) $6,986,620

    Sen. Roy Blunt (R-MO) $4,551,146

    Sen. Thom Tillis (R-NC) $4,418,012

    Sen. Cory Gardner (R-CO) $3,879,064

    Sen. Marco Rubio (R-FLA) $3,303,355

    Sen. Joni Ernst (R-IA) $3,124,273

    Sen. Rob Portman (R-OH) $3,061,941

    Sen. Todd Young (R-IN) $2,896,732

    Sen. Bill Cassidy (R-LA) $2,861,047

    Rep. French Hill (R-AR) $1,089,477

    Rep. Ken Buck (R-CO) $800,544

    Rep. David Young (R-IA) $707,662

    Rep. Mike Simpson (R-ID) $385,731

    Rep. Greg Gianforte (R-MT) $344,630

    Rep. Don Young (R-AK) $245,720

    Rep. Lloyd Smucker (R-PA) $221,736

    Rep. Bruce Poliquin (R-ME) $201,398

    Rep. Pete Sessions (R-TX) $158,111

    Rep. Barbara Comstock (R-VA) $137,232

    These are the numbers that can be reported. The NRA uses all kinds of dark money to get these candidates tons of “help.” In the end, as you watch the above politicians opine about “tragedy” just remember, the cost to buy their souls wasn’t that much in the scheme of things.

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  11. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Here Are The Autopsies For The Victims Of The Las Vegas Mass Shooting. The details are disturbing. But they sharpen a reality we must confront:

    Case #1

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters the right side of the victim’s head, creating multiple skull fractures and injuring multiple features of her brain, before reversing trajectory and exiting further down on the right side of her head.

    Case #2

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the right side of the victim’s upper chest, coursing through his chest cavity and abdomen, before exiting on the lower left side of his back.

    Case #3

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the back.

    The bullet enters the left side of the victim’s back, coursing through his chest cavity before taking a slightly upward trajectory and exiting through his left chest.

    Case #4

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the back.

    The bullet enters the victim’s left upper back, coursing through her chest cavity and causing injuries to the heart and lungs before coming to rest in the tissue of her right breast.

    Case #5

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wounds to the chest and forearm.

    A bullet enters the victim’s upper right chest, striking a rib, perforating her right lung, diaphragm and liver, before coming to rest in the soft tissue of her lower right chest. Another bullet enters through the victim’s back right forearm, passing cleanly through and exiting the front of her arm.

    Alphin believes both sets of injuries were caused by a single bullet that struck the victim on an unstable trajectory, likely because the overheated barrel of the gunman’s rifle had expanded from shooting so rapidly, sending rounds flying out more unpredictably.

    “Dollars to doughnuts, this is the same bullet that does all of this,” said Alphin. “The round was probably unstable, meaning it was wobbling slightly in free flight. That’s why you’ve got that slightly oblong entry wound, that indicates a bullet that was wobbling from that overheated barrel. It enters the forearm, then it goes through and has an irregular exit wound to the anterior right forearm. … Now the bullet is beginning to tumble [as it enters her chest].”

    Alphin added, “I would think she was standing, she realized there were bullets coming, she put her arm up and a bullet struck her.”

    Case #6

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s lower right arm and passes cleanly through it into her chest, where it injures her right lung and ultimately strikes her vertebral column, shattering the bullet.

    Case #7

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the right chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s right upper chest, perforating multiple features of her right lung, before coming to rest in the soft tissue of her central back.

    Case #8

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wounds to the head.

    One bullet enters the victim’s left eye, injuring her eye and fracturing her skull, before coming to rest in the muscles on the side of her head. Another bullet enters the right side of the victim’s head, causing additional skull fractures and injuring multiple features of her brain, before coming to rest in the back of her head. The victim also suffered a gunshot wound to the hand and a graze wound to the shoulder.

    Alphin explained how two separate bullets could have struck the victim in the head.

    “Both of those head wounds would be instantly fatal, which means the person would drop to the ground like a sack of rocks. There’s no way, even if the guy had kept the rifle stable and these are bullets that sequentially exited the muzzle, you’re still talking a couple tenths of a second between impacts and the body would have started to drop. I’m thinking one of these hit the victim standing and one of them hit her laying on the ground. Remember, all the shooter is doing is spraying bullets.”

    Case #9

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s right chest between the ribs, perforating his liver, stomach and diaphragm, before entering his left chest. The jacket of the bullet is recovered in the victim’s left lung, while the bullet itself is found in the space between two ribs.

    Case #10

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters through the right side of victim’s head, fracturing the skull, fragmenting the bullet and causing massive injuries to the brain.

    Case #11

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the back.

    The bullet enters the victim’s right back and passes through her shoulder blade and into her chest cavity, perforating her right lung, heart and left lung, before exiting from her left chest. Clusters of cuts and bruises suggest the victim was either dragged or trampled after collapsing.

    Alphin believes the bullet was wobbling when it struck the victim but says it’s hard to tell from the listed measurements.

    “Once the bullet travels down through the lungs, that’s a fatal wound,” he said. “Trauma and internal bleeding.”

    Case #12

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s left chest between his ribs, fracturing one of the bones and likely fragmenting the round, leading to perforations of his left lung, spleen, aorta, liver and right lung.

    Case #13

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the back.

    The bullet enters the victim’s left back around her sixth rib, likely fracturing a bone before passing through her left lung and piercing the major arteries of the heart.

    Case #14

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters near the top of the victim’s head, fracturing her skull and causing massive hemorrhaging of her brain. Contusions on the victim’s face were likely the result of her falling forward after being fatally struck.

    Case #15

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s right chest between her ribs, taking an upward trajectory through her right lung, aorta and across her midline, where it perforates her left lung and comes to rest in the tissue of her left shoulder.

    Alphin believes the bullet was stable in flight when it struck the victim but became unstable upon entry.

    “It basically hit perpendicular to the surface of the skin,” he said. “The bullet, as it’s precessing, probably clipped one of the ribs, and that’s why it’s unstable within the body and broke apart. That’s why there are fragments recovered.”

    Case #16

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters near the top of the victim’s head, coursing through his brain and into his neck before coming to rest in the tissue of his right shoulder. Additional abrasions suggest the victim fell after being struck and may have been dragged or trampled after collapsing.

    Case #17

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s left upper chest at a downward angle, where it likely strikes a bone, which fragments the round, casting pieces throughout his left chest.

    Case #18

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the back.

    The bullet enters the victim’s right upper back, fracturing her third rib and perforating multiple features of her right lung and her aorta before coming to rest in the tissue surrounding her heart.

    Case #19

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the neck.

    The bullet enters the center of the victim’s neck, severing multiple vertebrae and major arteries before exiting through the left side of her neck. Abrasions on the victim’s arm and legs suggest she may have been dragged or trampled after collapsing.

    Case #20

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters the victim’s left cheek, fracturing her skull and passing through multiple features of her face before severing her spinal cord and coming to rest in the tissue of her neck.

    Case #21

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters the right side of the victim’s forehead, fracturing his skull, injuring his brain and shattering the round.

    Case #22

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters the victim’s right upper chest, courses through his midline, passing through his carotid artery at the aorta and perforating his left lung before coming to rest in his lung tissue.

    Case #23

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters the right side of the victim’s head, injuring her right eye and brain before coming to rest in the left side of her brain. Another bullet enters through the back of the victim’s right forearm, injuring tissue but passing cleanly through.

    Case #24

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wounds to the head and leg.

    One bullet enters the right side of the victim’s head, fracturing her skull and injuring multiple features of her brain while shattering the round. Another bullet enters the front of the victim’s left leg, injuring tissue before coming to rest in the back of her leg.

    Case #25

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the back.

    The bullet enters the victim’s central upper back, coursing through her vertebral column, shattering the round and sending fragments through her aorta and into her vertebrae.

    Alphin says the autopsy indicates the bullet was in stable flight when it struck the victim perpendicular to the skin surface.

    “The bullet began to break apart fairly quickly, and it completely disintegrated upon striking the vertebral body,” he said.

    Case #26

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the neck.

    The bullet enters the right side of the victim’s neck, coursing through the tissue of the neck and into the upper vertebrae, where the round is recovered.

    Case #27

    Female

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the head.

    The bullet enters through the left side of the victim’s forehead, fracturing her skull and likely the round, before passing through multiple features of her brain.

    Case #28

    Male

    Cause of death: Gunshot wound to the chest.

    The bullet enters through the victim’s right upper chest, striking his right collarbone and coursing through his aorta and left lung before striking a left rib and coming to rest in the soft tissue of his left upper back.

    That is 28 of 58 killed in Las Vegas by a lone shooter. To read the rest of the autopsies, click here:

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/las-vegas-autopsy-documents_us_5a8234efe4b01467fcf08b97

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  12. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    :frown:

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  13. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    I am ready to break the cycle. Are you?

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  14. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Don’t forget, the NRA spent $30,000,000 to get Trump elected, and one of the first things Trump did as president was repeal a rule designed to block certain mentally ill people from purchasing guns.

    https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/02/28/517799119/trump-repeals-rule-designed-to-block-gun-sales-to-certain-mentally-ill-people

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  15. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Rename schools something else…

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  16. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    This what the NRA re-tweeted on Valentines Day, the day of the Parkland High School shooting. No words from them about the shooting.

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  17. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    This is how the GOP speak about mass shootings.

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  18. Weenis 1 year ago

    spitfire3dc: @Georockstar09 try not to mix up love of guns with love of control. Read how the people on this site, who think guns are good illustrate their own penchant for control. One is such a control freak he won’t let the public school system teach his children. He wants to control that aspect of their lives regardless of the negative social implications that could influence their ability to be contributing participants.

    … I assume this is me. So I’ll tell you a fun little story that happened a few weeks back.

    We had some friends that moved near us. They had a home built by a contractor in the area and were having an open house since they moved in. It was going to be mostly adults, since our friends are in their early 60’s and their kids aren’t near them. We took our took kids, my son who’s 10 and my daughter who is 8. When we get there, we set our wine in the kitchen, start mingling, and checking out the house.

    My 10 year old son goes and sits on the couch with our friend’s father who is in his mid to late 80’s, and the two of them met for the first time. We try and shield adults who might not want to talk or be with kids from kids, if it looks like the adult isn’t comfortable, so we will watch our kids and see if we can pick up social cues from the adult. Every time I looked over, the older gentleman was talking with my son, and my son would laugh, or they’re both intently paying attention to one another. Then I’d look over another time and they’re both giggling incessantly.

    This went on for about 45 minutes, until the older gentleman and his wife left.

    On the way home, I asked my son what him and the guy were discussing on the couch. Turns out the man was an engineer who worked in the early days of computers and application development. Kept up on current technology. They talked about Ada Lovelace, who my son had been reading about for school. He told my son that he was quite impressed that he even knew who that was. Then they were discussing raspberry pi’s, automation, robotics, artificial intelligence, how computers had advanced from the 60’s and 70’s, and about different programming languages and how modern languages differ from the languages of yesteryear.

    Before the older gentleman left, he came up to my wife and I and said, “I had a pleasure speaking with your son Sylas, he’s very smart, and he’s a good boy.”

    So spitfire, before you judge my motives around homeschooling, or before you come to incorrect conclusions about what might be missing from a homeschooler’s life socially or educationally, you should know what you’re talking about.

    It’s not that I want to strictly control what he learns, I want to give him the best chance possible to be able to provide for himself and his wife (should he choose to marry).

    I don’t care who’s kid it is on this website, if that kid is under 16 years of age, my son can outsmart, outwit, outprogram, do higher math, has better grammar, is more well read, and also has more real world skills.

    When my son is 16 years of age, it’s my goal as a father, for him to be an intern doing mathematics and software development for a Fortune 500 company.

    At his current trajectory, this is a very tangible goal. In the next couple years he’s going to have a few certifications, and at 12 I’m going to let him take the test (and pass) for his GED.

    Feel free to judge, but it’s actually going to be my little son who’s going to be the better for it, and be able to sustain himself PRIOR to the age of 18.

    Like I said, you don’t have a clue about what you’re talking about.

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    • Georockstar09 1 year ago

      @Weenis That sounds good. I’d actually do the exact same thing if I had kids, not because of control, but because I simply know that the quality of public schools in the US are substandard compared to the rest of the world, and I’d want them to get the best education too. Unless I move to Europe, where schools are pretty good.

      I don’t fully agree with spitfire about the concept of control. What I do agree with is trying to understand the populations’s underlying aspects, in the US, for things that lead to mass shootings and gun homicides, and figure out what leads to that, in order to indirectly reduce gun violence. Maybe it’s caused by a tendency for becoming socially isolated. Maybe it’s the rampant materialism that leads to valuing possessions above human lives. Maybe it’s this weird tendency in the US for people to accumulate weapons as a hobby, and not just guns. Why do they do that, why that particular hobby? Maybe there’s a lot of gun propaganda – I heard there was a gun show in Florida immediately after the shooting. You can’t expect a young male to look at a gun and not fantasize about using a gun for what it’s real original purpose is – killing people.

      So if we figure out what causes people’s desire for mass murders and gun violence, we can identify and eliminate those causes. And IF it’s as simple as seeing a gun and really wanting to use it for murder, then we gotta accept that we need some gun regulations. (Again, not ban. Regulation.) IF that’s the case, ofc.

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  19. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Dear Americans,

    It is your duty to listen to this child’s speech, all of it.

    Thank you.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxD3o-9H1lY

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis It’s sick to ignore these kids.

        It’s sick to see children gunned down in their schools.

        It’s sick that a 17 year old can legally purchase a weapon of mass destruction before he can buy a beer or vote.

        It’s sick to call these kids actors and claim that they don’t go to this school.

        It’s sick to make shit up, and pass it off as fact.

        You are pissing your pants because this generation will help make substantial change. The GOP and the stonewalling of zero gun reform’s days are numbered.

        #MarchForOurLives

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        What weapon of mass destruction can a 17 year old buy?

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis An AR-15 that can mass murder people is a weapon of mass destruction to me. I don’t give a fuck about semantics.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        This conversation has nothing to do with semantics, and everything to do with facts. An AR-15 isn’t a weapon of mass destruction… that’s just a fact.

        Another important fact to point out is that a 17 year old can’t legally buy an AR-15. Federal law requires an individual to be 18 years of age to purchase a rifle, and 21 years of age to purchase a handgun.

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      • Author
        Gina 1 year ago

        @Weenis My mistake. He is 19 years, and he bought his weapon of mass destruction legally.

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      • Weenis 1 year ago

        @Gina

        This is why there is no effective dialogue. People keep using and perpetuating terms that don’t match reality. A nuclear bomb is a weapon of mass destruction. A semi-automatic rifle is not. In any universe. Even modified with a bump stock.

        You’re engaging in redefinition, and it’s not intellectually honest, and doesn’t help dialogue between the many sides of the debate. It further puts a wedge of animosity between everyone.

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  20. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Two presidents.

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  21. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Donald and Melania Trump at a “disco party” they went to directly after visiting a single survivor of the Parkland massacre.

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  22. Author
    Gina 1 year ago

    Common excuses from the NRA and the GOP, but they don’t hold up.

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